#806683 - 11/22/08 08:47 PM
Switching from Xanax to Klonopin - help!
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anxiousinco
Journeyman
Registered: 04/27/07
Posts: 97
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Okay so I've been taking 2mg of Xanax a day for the past few months. 1 Xanax XR in the morning and 2 .5mg throughout the day (generally ended up taking the first .5mg about an hour after I took the XR - I don't think the XR really ever worked), taking my final dose before bed.
I recently went really unstable on my Xanax. It got to the point where I started having panic attacks at 5:30 in the morning - so severe that I'd be shaking like crazy trying to pull two of those little tablets out of the bottle, then letting them dissolve under my tongue to get the fear away and my heart would just keep pounding for a few hours.
I went and saw my doctor and he prescribed me Klonopin. I was trying to go for the Valium but he said that he doesn't feel comfortable doing that unless its a last resort since Valium is the only real option for smoothly getting someone off of benzos.
So my question is... He gave me a prescription for 60 .5 Klonopin and 60 .5 Xanax.
How would I go about transitioning? I know Klonopin is only supposed to be taken a maximum of three times a day which would only equal 1.5mg - am I going to have a severe withdrawal reaction by doing this?
What I did was yesterday I woke up in a panic so I took a xanax and took a klonopin with it, knowing that klonopin doesn't work anywhere near as fast as xanax. I got to work and the xanax had hit and I was fine... about an hour later, I was FLOORED. The klonopin hit me and it hit HARD. I went through the day pretty much okay until I went to smoke break... This was about 3 hours into the day... Came back from my smoke break and my heart was RACING... I didn't have the normal FEAR, but I knew the panic was coming. So I took a .5 xanax and dissolved it... Strangely enough, about 30 seconds later, my heart rate was LOWER than normal (usually xanax gives me tachycardia) and I was totally fine. When I left work at 6:30, I noticed my heart was racing again when I went to my car but as soon as I got in my car and sat down, things leveled out.
I came home and passed out at 10PM. We're talking out COLD. I woke up at 3AM (the time that I would normally take my Xanax) and took a Xanax at 3:30... that didn't work so I took one more at 5:30 and was out at 7:30 and slept til 2:30PM.
Today, I took a .5mg Xanax when I woke up... then about 2 hours later, I took .25mg Xanax with .25mg Klonopin and a few hours later, took another .5mg Xanax. I haven't felt this stable in a long time. I'm anxious but its not bad.
Am I being stupid? Should I really just trust the klonopin and drop the xanax and just use it if I have a panic attack? And should I take 3 .5s or should I just take the two? I don't know that 2 is going to be enough and I know my doctor will have no problem refilling my script early if I run out but I've made myself stable. He's not a pdoc - can't find a good one around here - so he hardly ever prescribes Klonopin. He just usually prescribes Xanax. He doesn't know much about it but both he and the pharmacist say that I shouldn't have withdrawals.
Anyone have any advice for me? I missed almost all of last week at work because I was so unstable and I don't want to go through that again - but at the same time, I know that Klonopin takes two weeks to hit peak plasma levels so I'm at a loss.
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#806719 - 11/22/08 11:37 PM
Re: Switching from Xanax to Klonopin - help!
[Re: anxiousinco]
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anxiousinco
Journeyman
Registered: 04/27/07
Posts: 97
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Well it looks like klonopin dissolved under the tongue works just like xanax does. That's a relief. I just started to have some really bad anxiety and the tachycardia was building - panic was right around the corner. Less than 45 seconds after dissolving the klonopin, it all calmed down.
I'm now at 1.5mg between the xanax and the klonopin - which is about what I normally would have been at 3 hours ago. Seems to be working.
Oh and Klonopin tastes MUCH better than Xanax. It tastes mildly like bananas LOL
Something tells me I should have made this switch a long time ago. I'm still curious what everyone else has to say.
I think tomorrow, I'm going to start the day with a klonopin and see how it goes... It seems like my body isn't freaking out as much as I thought it would. If push comes to shove, I can always supplement some xanax with it later...
Edited by anxiousinco (11/22/08 11:38 PM)
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#806740 - 11/23/08 05:28 AM
Re: Switching from Xanax to Klonopin - help!
[Re: Kryton]
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diem
Board Addict
Registered: 10/02/08
Posts: 385
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Is klonopin much more subtle coming down from than xanax?
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#806869 - 11/23/08 03:59 PM
Re: Switching from Xanax to Klonopin - help!
[Re: genethebean1]
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anxiousinco
Journeyman
Registered: 04/27/07
Posts: 97
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Well today, I took 1 klonopin and .25mg of xanax to combat my early morning anxiety - it KNOCKED ME OUT COLD! My sister just woke me up and was like dude, are you okay? lol
Anyway, yeah, I think the transition is going to be pretty smooth. I'll use my Xanax when I need it. Its going to be hard to get past the morning Xanax dose though because I wake up with so much anxiety that the long climb to Klonopin being effective isn't going to work.
"One thing I picked up on in your post is that you seem to not take you med as prescribed (it sounds like this is mainly when you are in the midst a panic attack)."
Well, my doctor prescribes it as needed. Basically, if I have a panic attack he knows what I do to get rid of it and he doesn't have any problem with it so long as it works - and it works very well. So I guess in a way, I'm still doing it the way he prescribed it.
Interesting that you mention that Calm stuff... I have it in my cabinet. I've noticed that it causes rebound anxiety so I don't take it... should I just try it continuously then? Someone at Whole Foods recommended it for anxiety and said it was great but it seemed like it made my anxiety worse in the end but I only tried it twice and it was nowhere near consistent.
As for the B vitamins, would a B complex be best or just B12 and B6? And what doses? I've tried an extended release B100 complex when I stopped drinking to avoid the nasty withdrawals and it worked fairly well but makes my panic attacks worse - probably TOO MUCH B in my system. I figured this out by the fact that the anxiety builds and builds and builds until I'm in a panic UNTIL I go to the bathroom and then I'm fine - and we all know the neon yellow that B-vitamins make the urine.
"I would take 0.5mg klonopin in the morning and 0.5mg klonopin in the evening until you are off the Xanax completely. Take the Xanax in the the day, try to take a max of twice a day though it may be more when needed and eventually replace it completely with 0.5mg klonopin in the middle of the day when your body is satutared with klonopin (should be after a week or two). That will also lower your overall intake from 2mg of Xanax to 1.5mg of klonopin which IMO is a positive move."
That sounds like a great idea and that is what I was considering. Thank you for giving me that idea, I'm going to try that. Besides, who knows, with how much klonopin knocks me out, I may be one of the people that experiences it to be twice as strong as Xanax in the end and would be taking too much if I bumped it to 1.5 or 2mg a day.
Thanks for the help everyone. I've been dealing with this since 2004 and its hard finding anyone who knows anything about it. I've posted other places and just gotten the generic "you must talk to your doctor", "get a new doctor", or "benzos will never help you, quit taking them" responses. This was much more productive. 
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#806875 - 11/23/08 04:25 PM
Re: Switching from Xanax to Klonopin - help!
[Re: genethebean1]
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anxiousinco
Journeyman
Registered: 04/27/07
Posts: 97
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Oh I know you weren't trying to to criticize me, sorry if I came off sounding defensive as it wasn't my intent.
I tend to have to taper most things up in my body so that may be the case with CALM. I still have it. I'll try it again sometime in a smaller dose.
Do you have any recommendations for good B6 and B12 supplements? I'm one of those people who doesn't like a lot of chemicals in his supplements and you'd be surprised how many supplements out there (Nature Made comes to mind) who've been bought by pharmaceutical companies and now have all kinds of junk - from synthetic vitamins to food coloring and lots of stuff inbetween.
On the sleep thing... I'm honestly so scared to try anything new. I've heard all the horror stories about Ambien, Lunesta, Restoril, etc., and it just scares me to death. My doctor wanted me to take a very small dose of amitryptiline at night and I was almost willing until I read about the horrible side effects of TCAs.
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#806898 - 11/23/08 05:35 PM
Re: Switching from Xanax to Klonopin - help!
[Re: nephro]
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anxiousinco
Journeyman
Registered: 04/27/07
Posts: 97
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Horrible side effects from what? You weren't specific. We were talking about a lot of things.
Anyway, I noticed something interesting. I'm actually breathing from my diaphragm now. Its an odd thing to notice but I haven't been able to breathe from my diaphragm for years. I don't know if its the Klonopin that's doing it or the fact that I'm not taking as much Xanax anymore but I've heard that diaphragm breathing helps a lot with anxiety too.
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#806972 - 11/23/08 10:28 PM
Re: Switching from Xanax to Klonopin - help!
[Re: genethebean1]
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anxiousinco
Journeyman
Registered: 04/27/07
Posts: 97
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Hmm thanks for the reassurance about the amitriptyline. I've been considering it because my doctor says that it also seems to help a lot of his patients that have panic attacks too, even though they just take the one 25mg dose at night.
Xanax leaves me feeling pretty spaced out the next day anyway so I can't imagine amitriptyline being much worse... Hell, benadryl leaves me feeling more spaced out than a night drinking and dancing while on my xanax - and that leaves me REALLY spaced out (and anxious, panicky, etc).
I might look into it. Something tells me that once the Klonopin starts working, my insomnia will resolve itself. A lot of my insomnia started when I started having night time panic attacks so yeah.
Anyway, I'm pretty impressed. I've had .5mg of Klonopin today and 1mg of Xanax... I JUST took the .5 of Xanax though and normally I would have taken it about 7 or 8PM and its almost 11:30 now.
I'm going to take a klonopin at 2 or 3 and see if it knocks me out like I think it will. If it does then I might get lucky and wake up tomorrow without the early morning anxiety from my Xanax wearing off at night and hopefully can just take a Klonopin before work, a quarter milligram of Xanax twice while at work, and a Klonopin before bed... Then hopefully I'll be able to cut down to .25mg Xanax the next day, etc.
One thing that's great is my body detoxes quickly. I've had quite a few addictions in my life... but when I made the decision to get over them, barring smoking and the occasional drink, I've gotten over them a LOT faster than most people do. Caffeine is a perfect example. After drinking 10-12 shots of espresso a day every day for 2-3 years, I stopped cold turkey one day and went through migraines and shakes for 2 days and I was done.
Hopefully it works the same with this transition.
Thanks for all the help and support. Its really appreciated. This is a scary thing for me. I willingly will admit that I rely on my Xanax and know I couldn't make it a single day without benzos flowing through my system on some level. Switching to Klonopin should ease that up a bit since it doesn't have the "rush" that Xanax does but rather sounds more like it functions like a traditional anti-depressant would by building up in the system and working in the background. That's exactly what I need.
Anyway, I'll keep updating you guys here. I'm going to try the Calm again... And as for deep breathing, once my panic attacks are stable I'll start practicing it but in the past its only made them worse. Pretty sad considering when I was 11 years old I used to meditate for hours on end, huh?
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#806982 - 11/23/08 11:36 PM
Re: Switching from Xanax to Klonopin - help!
[Re: anxiousinco]
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anxiousinco
Journeyman
Registered: 04/27/07
Posts: 97
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Yeah so the idea of one Klonopin in the morning and one in the evening isn't going to work. Just had a panic attack as I felt the Xanax withdrawals kick in. Looks like I'm going to be a three times a dayer. Its still a half a milligram less than I was taking of Xanax though.
Edited by anxiousinco (11/23/08 11:36 PM)
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#806993 - 11/24/08 01:18 AM
Re: Switching from Xanax to Klonopin - help!
[Re: JokerOwling]
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anxiousinco
Journeyman
Registered: 04/27/07
Posts: 97
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well I'm basically trying to taper off the xanax and slide into the klonopin. I made it most of the day today without issue. I'm going to try going to pure klonopin tomorrow but three times a day instead of two. Its definitely working though.
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#807023 - 11/24/08 05:31 AM
Re: Switching from Xanax to Klonopin - help!
[Re: nephro]
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bean_muncher
Member
Registered: 09/20/05
Posts: 196
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"I know Klonopin is only supposed to be taken a maximum of three times a day which would only equal 1.5mg - am I going to have a severe withdrawal reaction by doing this?"
i disagree with the statement of only being able to take klonopin 3xd because my mother is prescribed the 1mg 4 x d. they work wonders for her conversion disorder and shakin spells.
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#807084 - 11/24/08 09:27 AM
Re: Switching from Xanax to Klonopin - help!
[Re: anxiousinco]
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funkybreakz
Pooh-Bah
Registered: 01/24/04
Posts: 1307
Loc: My Living Room
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Yeah so the idea of one Klonopin in the morning and one in the evening isn't going to work. Just had a panic attack as I felt the Xanax withdrawals kick in. Looks like I'm going to be a three times a dayer. Its still a half a milligram less than I was taking of Xanax though.
Keep in mind that clonazepam is more potent and has a longer half life than alprazolam.
_________________________
cat on a tin roof, dogs in a pile, nothin left to do but smile smile smile!
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#807335 - 11/24/08 07:31 PM
Re: Switching from Xanax to Klonopin - help!
[Re: genethebean1]
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anxiousinco
Journeyman
Registered: 04/27/07
Posts: 97
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See the problem I have is that I don't get anxious - I have full blown panic attacks that are so severe I am ready to call the ambulance. I think the only way I will be able to do this is a slow taper to klonopin with just half a xanax as needed. I missed work today because I got so anxious last night and couldn't sleep until 8AM. Then I finally passed out. And didn't wake til 4.
I really hope I can move myself to the klonopin otherwise I'm afraid for myself because.nothing but benzos work. I'd rather be on benzos the rest of my life than go through the withdrawals of not having them.
Anyway I've had two klonopin today and 1 total xanax. I feel really anxious but I'm going to keep with it. It shouldn't take much longer before my body adjusts to not having the xanax influence. At least I hope so.
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#807365 - 11/24/08 11:53 PM
Re: Switching from Xanax to Klonopin - help!
[Re: anxiousinco]
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anxiousinco
Journeyman
Registered: 04/27/07
Posts: 97
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Yeah so today has sucked. I've had a really bad day. I'm definitely withdrawing from xanax and badly. I don't know what to do. The withdrawals are so bad that I don't know what to do. I've had klonopin and xanax both today and I just feel like [censored].
I guess I'm going to have to work out a slow taper. Let's hope I can sleep tonight. I need to be able to work and I can't work right now.
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#807377 - 11/25/08 02:55 AM
Re: Switching from Xanax to Klonopin - help!
[Re: anxiousinco]
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JokerOwling
Pooh-Bah
Registered: 07/14/07
Posts: 1214
Loc: here at the moment
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Sorry to hear you're having a difficult time.
Maybe you can try,and these are just suggestions,cutting the Xanax tabs so you are having less dose each time.Like take 0.25mg instead of 0.5mg.You will most likely have to accept some amount of withdrawal and having panic attacks,just know they get better as the Xanax leaves your body.The more you take Xanax with the clonazepam,the harder it will be to drop the Xanax.
Some other things that helped me was taking small amounts of either 5-htp or L-tryptophan,along with either DLPA,tyrosine or L-dopa(mucuna pruriens)and melatonin.Only take small doses though.
Along with those, magnesium and calcium,and possibly even glutamine and/or gaba and phenibut.
One of the best supplements for helping restore the body and help relax,especially during withdrawal from benzos is some form of essential fatty acids(I prefer flaxseed oil).
I've gone from Xanax to clonazepam numerous times and I felt the panic attack feeling as well.I also have an oxygen tank and glucose tablets and drinks,which often help.
Sometimes you just have to ride it through until your body adjusts without Xanax.Some people have no problems switching over,while others have quite alot of problems.Everyone is different.
I also found that if I stayed away from a Xanax schedule and just took it when the symptoms were unbearable,it made things easier.eg. I may not have had any Xanax for a day or 2,and then needed 2 doses for a day,then maybe none for a day and then 1 small dose the following day.Sort of a 2 steps forward one step back concept.Always try and take the smallest dose of Xanax as possible,otherwise the clonazepam will not get a chance to do its job and you will be stuck on 2 benzos.
_________________________
"A magnesium deficiency may be responsible for more diseases than any other nutrient."-Dr.Norman Shealy,Neurosurgeon&Chronic Pain expert.
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#807559 - 11/25/08 02:11 PM
Re: Switching from Xanax to Klonopin - help!
[Re: JokerOwling]
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anxiousinco
Journeyman
Registered: 04/27/07
Posts: 97
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Yeah I'm trying to cut back the xanax. I've been taking half doses whenever I feel like I really need it rather than full doses. The problem comes in at night though. I just can't sleep without the xanax because as soon as I start trying to sleep I start focusing on my heart rate. I'm sure you know how that goes. The klonopin is slowly shifting into action. The thing that is so hard is that I wasn't stable on my xanax to begin with. Had I been stable the transition probably would have been a lot easier.
Ill look at adding omega 3s. I prefer fish oil to flaxseed. Flax doesn't seem to agree with me. 5-HTP makes me hallucinate so that's not an option and I'm going to try to drink some mag Calm today and see how that goes. I'm forcing myself to go to work later today. Like 4 or 5. Hopefully that goes well.
If nothing else it should be working much better tomorrow since I've been on it since Friday don't you think? I bumped the dose to three times a day yesterday. I'm going to continue that today. I think it would be easier to lower the dose later once I'm stable and not having daily panic attacks.
I will tell you though - this ROUGH! I thought that quitting alcohol was rough... That was done in three days. I just can't seem to stop myself from taking the xanax but I'm going to fight it. I've heard that valerian works really well with xanax withdrawals so I might pick some up and start taking it.
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#807646 - 11/25/08 06:29 PM
Re: Switching from Xanax to Klonopin - help!
[Re: anxiousinco]
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anxiousinco
Journeyman
Registered: 04/27/07
Posts: 97
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I haven't taken any Xanax today. I've been up for 5 hours and I've had no Xanax at all. May not seem like an accomplishment to most but its like a miracle to me. I usually can't make it an hour without Xanax. Here's what I did.
Took one Klonopin upon waking and another one about two hours later to sort of simulate the 1mg XR that I was taking... Then I took some Valerian and fish oil about an hour ago... The Valerian took away ALL of the Xanax withdrawals and hit about as fast as Xanax does. I just took another Valerian (it wears off fast) and in a little while, I'll take two more F Complex (fish and flax) capsules and a dose of klonopin.
I feel a LOT better NOT taking the Xanax than when I do. When I take Xanax, it has a really rough start and makes my heart pound out of my chest before it settles in and starts relieving my anxiety. Valerian did this to a very very small degree but it seems like the rumors are true - Valerian is basically a natural form of valium (although very short lived). I was pretty skeptical about it until now. I even feel a pleasant mild benzo rush going through me and I'm slightly drowsy.
The great thing about replacing Xanax with Valerian is Valerian isn't habit forming. There have also been studies that show Valerian to contain varying amounts of GABA too.
I wish I knew about Valerian's anxiolytic properties before I ever even started with the benzos... I probably wouldn't be in the position I'm in today!
Anyway, just updating you all on my progress. Today has been great so far. Another welcome side effect of the klonopin is it has slowed down my metabolism - my blood sugar doesn't seem to crash anywhere near as fast as it used to.
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#807715 - 11/25/08 11:37 PM
Re: Switching from Xanax to Klonopin - help!
[Re: SoHoTribeca]
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anxiousinco
Journeyman
Registered: 04/27/07
Posts: 97
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I didn't talk to my doctor about it. He doesn't know anything about herbs and such. Very old school type. But Valerian isn't known to have any interactions with drugs. I did end up finally breaking down and taking .25mg of Xanax but considering I was taking 2mg a day on Thursday I'd say I'm making a lot of progress.
And yeah my next supplement step is to take magnesium. I also took a B6 about half an hour ago. Gotta get some B12 as I don't have it in the house.
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#807924 - 11/26/08 01:18 PM
Re: Switching from Xanax to Klonopin - help!
[Re: JokerOwling]
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anxiousinco
Journeyman
Registered: 04/27/07
Posts: 97
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I was thinking about picking up that CalMag Calm stuff since I've heard its mostly pointless to take mag without cal.
Thanks for that site. What dose would you recommend? (I've got a 1mg accurate scale)
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